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A French (?) Monday Mystery Coupé de Ville
I am not sure whether the magnificent Coupé de Ville on the attached photo is really a mystery to other prewar car enthusisast - at least it's one to me. My gut feeling tells me it might be a car from a French manufacturer. Maybe fellow enthusiasts from across the ......
Pubblicato:
domenica marzo 19th, 2017
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Sconosciuto
23 Marzo 2017, 13:52
I have sent a photo of my 1924 Turcat Mery to the Share a Photo Section of this magazine along with an explanation of why it is my opinion that the mystery car is not a Turcat Mery. I do not know what it is other than that I believe it to be French.
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Sconosciuto
23 Marzo 2017, 09:52
Gentlemen,
Thanks a lot for the many contributions which I found all worth considering.
Probably, we won't find the definitive answer given the poor condition of the print (possibly also due to unfavourable storage over the past 90 years).
Given the current state of affairs, I tend to believe it's a Rolland-Pilain RP which was introduced in 1919 and had a 2.9 litre 4-cylinder engine. There appears to have been a 6-cylinder version, as well, which had a longer chassis. Yet, it's difficult to tell from the picture, whether it's one of the longer wheel-base cars or not.
Anyway, it's a superb automobile thanks to its elegant body which would make it highly desirable today (most surviving cars of that marque seem to be phaetons).
As for the date of the picture, I'd plead for "very soon after WW1", based on the fashion of the people in the picture. A young lady with such a prewar-style hat would have looked seriously old-fashioned by the mid-1920s...
Michael
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Thanks a lot for the many contributions which I found all worth considering.
Probably, we won't find the definitive answer given the poor condition of the print (possibly also due to unfavourable storage over the past 90 years).
Given the current state of affairs, I tend to believe it's a Rolland-Pilain RP which was introduced in 1919 and had a 2.9 litre 4-cylinder engine. There appears to have been a 6-cylinder version, as well, which had a longer chassis. Yet, it's difficult to tell from the picture, whether it's one of the longer wheel-base cars or not.
Anyway, it's a superb automobile thanks to its elegant body which would make it highly desirable today (most surviving cars of that marque seem to be phaetons).
As for the date of the picture, I'd plead for "very soon after WW1", based on the fashion of the people in the picture. A young lady with such a prewar-style hat would have looked seriously old-fashioned by the mid-1920s...
Michael
Sconosciuto
23 Marzo 2017, 00:04
The photo of our car is in the Share Photos section of the site.
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Sconosciuto
22 Marzo 2017, 21:29
D'accord avec Ph. Becret, je pense à une Rolland Pilain RP identique à celle des 24h du Mans 1923
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Sconosciuto
22 Marzo 2017, 14:38
Je suis d'accord avec Ph. Becret,
certainement une Rolland Pilain type RP.
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certainement une Rolland Pilain type RP.
Sconosciuto
22 Marzo 2017, 08:59
More often than not photographs from this period were of very high quality [glass plate negs]. This particular offering is of very poor quality and 'out of focus' which makes it near impossible to identify which is a shame.
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Sconosciuto
22 Marzo 2017, 08:12
I took a closer look at the original print and I can assure you that the car does not have front-wheel brakes.
I don't believe that this splendid vehicle was manufactured much later than c.1920...
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I don't believe that this splendid vehicle was manufactured much later than c.1920...
Sconosciuto
22 Marzo 2017, 07:46
The top of the radiator seems to be somewhat overhanging. This reminds me of Martini, which used such a type of radiator roughly between 1914 and 1916. The body with the slightly dropping waistline could have been built by e.g. Geissberger or Eckerlin.
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Sconosciuto
22 Marzo 2017, 05:01
Hard to tell from the photo if there are FWB. I think Farman ALWAYS had them. Also that they were bigger than the relative small rear drums. Tutcat Mery seemed to have larger drums on most models. If you look hard you can almost imagine the Turcat/Lorraine shoulder on the radiator just above the LH headlight. My imagination? The 62mm Rudge hubs seem right for Turcat. The only Turcats that I recall having the radiator sloping towards the bottom ala Voisin was the later models UG etc c.1925-27. The bonnet looks too long for the later 4 cyl Turcat Merys though. I will send a photo of our 1925 TM SG taken from a similar angle as the photo just for comparison.
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Sconosciuto
21 Marzo 2017, 23:55
If it's a Farman it's probbaly a 6.5 litre A6A with 2wb. I could also go with Turcat Méry - most likely the pre-war 6.3 litre chassis, considering the wheelbase and the weight of the body. Others will know for sure, but it seems that their post-war cars had 4-wheel brakes. Did Voisin produce a 2wb chassis with such a long wheelbase?
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Sconosciuto
21 Marzo 2017, 18:13
Michael,
To me it looks very much like a Farman. I think its called a Farman A6B coupe.
Is it this one? (on the left)
https://www.auto-veteran.com/index.php/en/latest-news/item/295-schloss-dyck-en
Rob
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To me it looks very much like a Farman. I think its called a Farman A6B coupe.
Is it this one? (on the left)
https://www.auto-veteran.com/index.php/en/latest-news/item/295-schloss-dyck-en
Rob
Sconosciuto
21 Marzo 2017, 16:51
I am sure that you will appreciate that I defer to the little girl, it is a TURCAT.
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Sconosciuto
21 Marzo 2017, 11:07
Hello Philippe,
thanks for your suggestion.
Indeed, the radiator cowling with the sloping top would be consistent with a Rolland-Pilain from around 1914-20 rather than with a Farman.
Maybe, it's worth investigating further into this direction.
Michael
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thanks for your suggestion.
Indeed, the radiator cowling with the sloping top would be consistent with a Rolland-Pilain from around 1914-20 rather than with a Farman.
Maybe, it's worth investigating further into this direction.
Michael
Sconosciuto
21 Marzo 2017, 10:58
Rolland Pillain is the most likely based on the radiator and elegance generally of the chassis. Although Turcat Mery holds water too. The radiator shape however doesn't have the usual 'notches' in the upper section. Making Rolland Pilain more likely.
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Sconosciuto
20 Marzo 2017, 23:53
Hello Peter,
I'd really love the idea that it's a Farman and there are some stylistical similarities, indeed.
Still, a Farman would have been a bit more flamboyant, don' you think?
At least I couldn't find a perfect match, so far.
Kind regards,
Michael
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I'd really love the idea that it's a Farman and there are some stylistical similarities, indeed.
Still, a Farman would have been a bit more flamboyant, don' you think?
At least I couldn't find a perfect match, so far.
Kind regards,
Michael