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PWC Workshop: to electronic or not to electronic?


More and more classic cars have electronic ignition (some pre-wars even electronic petrol injection!). There are great fans and there is strong opposition. So we throw the 'dead cat' on the table and show you the how to and love to gauge your opinion either pro or con...

Altough not original, one can have its reasons why to equip his car with this modern part. Today we would like to give you some explanation of the ignition itself. And in next weeks article, we will explain how to convert your car to the system.

The question is why to use an electronic ignition on your classic or vintage car? There are two main reasons. First: you cannot get the parts or revision of a magneto is too expensive.
Secondly: comfort. I'll explain this last argument later on. I'll first give an overview of the components of an electronic ignition: the electronic sensor, the electronics and eventually the software and the coil.

Electronic sensor
The electronic sensor replaces the breaker points and gives the signal to the electronics to activate the coil and to give a spark. I'm using Hall sensors of Honeywell. I have two types.
The SR17C is a fork model and through the fork runs a (soft iron) vane. For a 4 cylinder engine the vane has 4 blades. When the blade enters the sensor the coil will be activated by the electronics; leaving the sensor the activation stops and there is a spark. The second is a SR13R. This one is activated by magnets. Above the sensor a rotor is turning with 4 x 2 magnets (4 cylinder). When a northpole passes, the coil will be activated. A southpole initiates the spark.
The length of the blades or the distance between southpole and northpole determines the dwell angle. For a standard coil the dwell time is about 4 milliseconds. However, the speed of the engine influences the dwell time. So the length of the vane blades will be chosen based on two third of the top revolutions of the engine.
The use of a (breaker point) capacitor is not neccessary anymore.

Electronics and software
The electronics translates the sensor signal to a switch of the main transistor. The main transistor in the electronics switches the coil. Now there are two types of electronic regulation. First: you can have a fixed ignition timing. The neccessary retard of the ignition will be regulated by hand, or by mechanic and/or vacuum retard.
Secondly: The ignition timing will be regulated fully digital by a processor. The ignition timing is mapped in the software and depending of the revs of the engine the electronics regulates the ignition timing. Also the dwell angle will be regulated by the software, so there is always a fxed dwell time of 4 milliseconds.
For a classic or vintage car I don't advise to buy a fully digital ignition. The price is higher and the advantage is negligible, unless there are non solvable problems with the mechanic or vacuum retard.

Coil
The coil is the most important part of the ignition. The coil transfers low tension to high tension. For a powerfull spark it's neccessary to have the best coil you can get. A coil that's getting warm or hot, you can better throw it away. A temperature of max 40° C is rather normal. Is the temperature higher, the dwell angle is too big or the coil is defective. Always buy a coil of the well known brand e.g. Bosch, BERU, etc. For a 6 volt car a BERU ZS 105 is suitable; for 12 volt choose the BERU ZS 106.

What's the comfort?
• No periodic adjustment of the breaker points• Always correct ignition timing
• Adjusting of ignition with LED light
• No capacitor
• Indifferent for humidity
• Powerfull spark (=fuel efficiency)

What's the disadvantage?
• You have to adapt your distributor to install the sensor and rotor; you have to do some mechanic work
• You car is not original anymore (forget Best of Show at Pebble Beach)

Words: Bert van de Zand
 

Pubblicato:
martedì luglio 19th, 2016
Sconosciuto
28 Luglio 2016, 13:23
I have had the Accuspark electronic ignition fitted to my Rover P6 for over 12 years & done over 50,000 miles, delivers consistent performance, never needs adjusting, this is versus poor quality replacement parts - points where the nylon heels melt, condensers from dubious sources, why bother? The Accuspark is a magnetic switch fits wholly inside the distributor and made to fit on the points mounting holes, so is fully reversible (I wouldn't go back) a true fit & forget upgrade, does everything the points does, but consistently, time after time without wear or adjustment, stop deluding yourself, to me it is a no-brainer.
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 18:53
I can understand if you can't find original parts, but otherwise... If you need a car with modern comfort, buy a new car! Our 65 years old English sportscar with Lucas system still performs well so what's the problem with your cars?
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 18:08
I have had several old cars modified with modern electronic ignition. They run fine but look non-authentic. They also occasionally fail, usually without warning. The old breaker points require maintenance but if we do not drive our collectors cars many miles that is not an issue. The worst problem with updating a collector car is knowing where to stop updating. How about disk brakes, a dual master cylinder, a power booster all in the name of safety? How about replacing the old wheels with modern ones with modern tires, also for safety? How about an alternator instead of the generator? How about bigger tail lights? How about turn signals? The list is very long.
Finally if you want to get all the benefits of a modern car why not just buy a modern car?
I like my collector cars because they are old and do not have the wonderful technology of my modern cars. If I want to jump in the car every day and drive fast without thinking about maintenance I get in my modern car.
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 17:09
I can always make the points run. With the electronic, you need to buy another unit to carry with you for when the computer dies. I've driven my 1930 Willys-Knight over 40,000 miles in 6 years. Yes, the points did close up on it once. I reset them and drove away. I'll stick with my points. And thanks for the always fantastic web site!
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 15:28
Well I am torn with that matter as well. As the quality of points seem to disintgrate a a fast rate and even the well known german brand delivers points that only last 3000 km´s I have started with ignitor products many years ago. They perform well and you can see almost no difference from outside. The reliabilty is nothing to worry about and you can always swap back. The same with the dutch 123 distributors, they do not look right but the improvement on engine tickover and acceleration is noticable. So far I have converted Austin Healeys, Midgets, Spitfires, Jaguars, Mercedes and VW´s. On every single one I noticed a difference in exhaust gases, miles per gallon increased and I see and hope that airpollution is a bit less. I just put a 123 distributor into my 1964 E-type. But I have to admit, it´s not correct, if the thing goes wrong I will not be able to make a roadside repair but I do not have to fiddle around with the dammn points every 2000 km´s so I prefer it original otherwise but on the ignition side I am a modernist.
kind regards to all the people making that wonderful site!
Thomas from the tyrol
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 12:56
Well,
We rallied Austin 7's with all original ignition components down into the Sahara without any problems, despite the 50 degree heat and all! O.K. we did fit Bosch 6V sports coils (the blue ones!).
Simply, original parts work very well if properly installed, you know what you are doing (and you carry spares if doing serious things). All very easy to do.
These cars were driven tens of thousands of miles on these components without problems. It is up to you, but I would rather use original parts than alter things unnecessarily.
Regards, Peter
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 10:13
I understand the fitting of electronic ignition when parts are otherwise unobtainable or prohibitively expensive, but otherwise, what problems are we trying to solve? Contact breaker ignition works well and I have been using it in my car for 53 years (in a 80 year old car) with no problems. Modern electronics fail without warning, as owners who have swapped will testify.
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 10:02
My old and original three point ignition for the two-stroke DKW engine failed me recently in the middle of beautiful Eifel area Germany. A condensator died and there I was on the side of the road. But clever me, a complete ignition-house with new stuff inside and exactly adjusted to perform on this engine I was carrying in the trunk for a long time, so after 15 minutes we drove off again without hocus pocus electronics :-)
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 06:25
i have been thinking about this for my ALF as i cannot find the parts i need to repair the distributor
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 05:54
Yes use it . Yes i understand sympathetic restoration but as mention in the article money. Also it about enjoying your classic and not siting there fixing it.
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Tony Hillyard
20 Luglio 2016, 05:48
A very clear explanation, thank you. I'm not sure that getting all reliable and super efficient is what attracts me prewar cars. It's a personal thing, I like to drive my cars with the technology of the time, as their original owners did. For me that is part of the charm.
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 02:23
I am not sure I am all that exited about these "modern" ignition components. They fail, and when they do, a strip of emory and a feeler gage is not going to fix it. Went though that on a Porsche 356. Restored the original points and it works great again.
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Sconosciuto
20 Luglio 2016, 01:29
Bert - I'm torn here. Always wanted to win at Pebble Beach but in reality I also wanted to wed Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Neither will happen, pity. I'm personally a fan of subtle upgrades but not if it's just to correct a simple fault. Old adage "blame the carbs" springs to mind. If you seek originality then that's your poison and good luck. But if it's drivability then a disguised alternator for an under-performing dynamo or heavens a Kenlow fan addition are just fine but please try to make any change retrofittable as fashions also change.
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